On this episode, Chanel and I talk about: how her experience of being misdiagnosed with thyroid cancer changed her perspective and personality, the story of one of her depressive episodes, including how it started and how it ended, the root causes of our compulsive and excessive behaviors, and how to overcome the pressure to be nonchalant and instead show the people in your life that you care about them. The podcast isn’t exclusively focused on heavy topics, and there’s more laughter and lightheartedness in this episode than any before. Some of the lighter topics include: Chanel’s theory about fuccbois, under what circumstances does ordering pizza become a sign that you need an intervention, and how to act like a sociopath to make people fall in love with you. Chanel is hilarious, smart, and kind, and I’m very grateful that I have the opportunity to share this conversation with you.


  • Intro [0:00]
  • Who is Chanel Van Eeden? [6:30]
  • Chanel’s proposed reorganization of social media/Why I think comfort is dangerous [8:30]
  • My artistic process [24:00]
  • Chanel’s experience with depression pt.1 (how it started) [43:40]
  • How Chanel finds the courage to be earnest in our ironic, non-intimate, “cool” world. How to overcome the impulse to be see as cool and shamelessly perform vulnerable acts of kindness, and stories of when it’s backfired for us [47:50]
  • What sorts of excessive or compulsive behaviors do we currently struggle with? My biggest emotional issue: a fear that I’m unloveable [1:22:00]
  • How to be less intimidating in a relationship. Stories of intimidation holding us back in relationships [2:00:00]
  • Chanel’s experience with depression pt.2 (thyroid cancer, dropping out, overcoming depression) [2:14:30]
  • Do I obsess over doing things to repress a certain emotion? [2:45:35]
  • Chanel asks, “when did you realize that your parents were human and what was that like?” [3:14:00]
  • If Chanel could learn anything, what would she choose to learn? (incredible answer) [3:19:00]
  • We ask each other, “what is something that I do, that I’m good at, that I should keep doing?” [3:20:30]


Selected Links for the Episode:


Selected Quotes from the Episode:

  • “It takes time to do stuff with your life and to get to a better place. If you’re throwing time away, you’re in trouble.”

  • “There’s this facade that people put on where they don’t care about anything at all” -Chanel

  • “If I can’t let you know that I care about you, if you get weird about that, then maybe I should care about you less.”

  • “I think the drive for [lack of intimacy] is ‘how can I not address the issues in my life’ by working out a lot, or sleeping with a lot of girls to numb myself.” -Chanel

  • “Why would I want to turn someone into a band-aid and then throw them away at the end?”

  • “Any excessive behavior is because you are not addressing issues that you have” -Chanel

  • “I would hate myself, then I would do something I regretted, and then I would feel bad about it, and then I would shame myself about it.”

  • “I felt the flippant nature of what life was, and it could end really soon for me, or I could get into a really crappy situation where I was gonna have to deal with medical things everyday and I was not going to be able to do anything, so I was going to do as many things as I can now and have fun and not worry about what my morality might say about it, or what my conscious is saying. I served myself… only in that time frame.” -Chanel

  • “It’s really arrogant to think I understand this person’s life and I know how to live it better than them”